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KKGlinka wrote:What's even more interesting is that, even though she's become less overtly emotional, she's become more overtly demonstrative in a very deliberate, though restrained, fashion. Which, unfortunately, Trip kept shooting down.

I think Season 5: The Reverse Pursuit, Serious Vulcan Style would have been fabo.

Trip was such a hurtin' puppy at that point. She may have been more overtly demonstrative, but it was easy to miss because she was still far too self-protective. In fact, when I read this I found myself wondering just what you were referring to, unless it was her attempts to engage him after Affliction. He did shoot her down, but it wasn't much to shoot at. It was like, "Is that really all you've got? After what you've put me through?"

But I agree, your Season 5 there would have been faboo. In fact, that's basically what I'm here for.

Um... right after Affliction she was still married. Trip is an honorable man. he COULDN'T respond to her then. As soon as she was loose from Koss he came running, and ran smack into a wall of ice.

Actually Trip and Reed discuss her divorce in one of those Romulan/Aenar eps before Affliction. Affliction is the Augments ep where he's leaving and she asks him why. So if she's making any little attempts it's in Affliction, Divergence, and Bound. But as I said, her attempts aren't all that impressive at this stage of the game. She's going to have to ante up a whole lot more than a question or two.

So what'd she do aside from ask if he was leaving because of her? Bnb was right, even if he go the episodes mixed up - Trip waited until T'Pol was free from that sham marriage, and when he did all he got was the "I need some alone time" talk. He even kept reaching out to her during the whole Aenar thing only to basically have her smack him down, over and over again. By the time she finally came around to talk to him, it was already way too late - he'd had enough and his bags were literally packed.

I'm not arguing that. I agree with you. Though T'Pol no doubt did feel he was shooting her down, it wasn't like she ever really went out on a limb.

What I have read here, about T'Pol (and Vulcan in the main) pushes me to try to state some considerations, someway also personal.
Why do I love T'Pol? And why Enterprise? Surely there are NOT certain responses. My own taste, my past experiences, something I saw in the show and that struck me, and a lot of other things, more or less evident, more or less clear.
But , for me, there's one thing above all.
The sense of primitivism, of "This is the beginning", which pervades Enterprise.
Humans are reorganizing after the war. They hope and are naive. They are about to conquer the Space.
Under the not too liked tutelage of Vulcans.
And Vulcans?
Well, they, too, seem to me a little bit "primitive".
Of course. It's so.
Their society is slightly paranoid, and full of prejudices (not only in the matter of Humans, I think - BTW, it's Enterprise's merit to show something about these imperfect Vulcans).
OK.
So, in this Vulcan society a Vulcan female grows up, nurtured with all the ideas (and all the prejudices) of this society.
She's young, smart, curious, and (Eh, just so ) also lovely.
And absolutely Vulcan.
And suddenly this young (YOUNG, remember!) Vulcan girl finds herself among an emotional (who knows? Maybe also scary?) crew of Humans.
And between this crew, there's a man, in particular, who tickles her.
Et Voila, les jeux sont faites!
Well, in the authors' intentions probably there was the only will to create a sort of potentially romantic situation (Which works always), and the predestined man likely was another.
But you know. Sometimes things win the day (Luckily! )
Anyway, in the circumstances I have described it was inevitable that something would happen,
And now we are at the point.
How can it be handled a young Vulcan female in love?
That’s easy with a Human. But with a Vulcan? Female, furthermore.
Simple, very simple!
It's be sufficient to make her behave in the way we have seen on the screen.
A little bit of so said Vulcanity; a little bit of so said Humanity.
One step ahead; two steps backward.
The famous angst of the fourth season which so much irritates me (Well! I said: me! )
An gruelling shilly-shally!
But (I can hear somebody telling me that) she's Vulcan. She doesn't know how she have to handle emotions. Mosts, she suppresses emotions. As Vulcans do.
Mh... Here there's something which gives me a lot of things to consider.
Maybe I'm mistaking, but the truth is that Vulcans are CONTROLLING emotions, rather than suppress them.
They are a very emotional race. No doubt about that. They have a very superior brain ability (perhaps), but they HAVE emotions.
And (If I'm wrong, correct me please) it's only on Enterprise that you can hear of "suppressed emotion", rather than "controlled emotions".
And then... Please tell me if it isn't an emotion the T'Pol's wish to experience emotions.
But she have to be Vulcan. Cold.
So, here it is Kir'Shara.
She understands. She searches for her true path.
Honestly I find Kir'Shara indeed more foolish than CX finds foolish the Bond.
At least Vulcans are known as a sort of telepathic race.
A fine, telepathic, EMOTIONAL race which - suddenly - is capable of finding herself in the mysticism of Surak. Twice! Earlier, they are almost destroying reciprocally themselves (because of their strong emotions) and then, abruptly, they become capable of controlling them (Ah, the logic!). After, they rediscover Surak, and they (and T'Pol) must follow again the true path.
Poor Trip! Into what kind of trap he has fallen!
Ah, but don't worry! There's Phlox!
Now, I know I'm about to say something many people will find as wrong. Very wrong.
I like Phlox, but not too much.
I don't find him too nice.
Not only he's the prototype of the omniscient and paternalistic doctor that I (I, be sure!) hate. (I prefer the evanescent doctor of VOY).
Oh yes! It's a very good doctor, the doctor who dismisses a Trip in love with a problematic Vulcan female (who doesn't cease to be stubborn and stupid) using a few of unceremonious and cold words. Just he! Who had almost pushed T'Pol to go with Trip!
So, at last, you can understand why I love Enterprise. And T'Pol.
If, in the end of all these jeremiads, I'm here, talking about Enterprise and about Trip and (Eh Eh... above all ) about T'Pol...damn it! There must be really something strongly alluring in Enterprise. And in T'Pol!
Oh well! I posted a very long message!
I hope it was understandable, at least a tiny bit.
But you must forgive me.
I wanted to celebrate.
I became Commodore!

You are the eternal, incurable optimist Asso.

Don't take optimism away from me, please, blacknblue.

As Connor T put it in that interview Drogna posted, you only really complain passionately about the things you love. Otherwise, you just don't bother because you don't really care enough.

(He used the Lakers as his example. In my husband's case it would be the Mets.)

When it came to the Kir'shara I think they should've gone into more detail about it than they did.Alelou does have a good point though about what Connor said.I think they should've shown more of how T'Pol was dealing with all the upheval she was going through and more of how she was learning to control her emotions.And Trip as well when he was fruastrated about her shutting him out.I would've liked to see a season 5 would deal with T'Pol and Trip's relationship.

Alelou wrote:As Connor T put it in that interview Drogna posted, you only really complain passionately about the things you love. Otherwise, you just don't bother because you don't really care enough.

A wisdom pill.

Reanok wrote:When it came to the Kir'shara I think they should've gone into more detail about it than they did.Alelou does have a good point though about what Connor said.I think they should've shown more of how T'Pol was dealing with all the upheval she was going through and more of how she was learning to control her emotions.And Trip as well when he was fruastrated about her shutting him out.I would've liked to see a season 5 would deal with T'Pol and Trip's relationship.

Yeah. Me too, of course.
And sometimes a thought comes to my mind.
Unquestionably the Trip and T'Pol's story had become a very important thread of the entire show.
Rightly or wrongly, little by little their difficult relationship had almost overpowered a lot of other threads, real and potential.
It's sufficient you think of the last scene of the fourth season: this scene is only of Trip and T'Pol, almost a promise of an important future developing.
Now. I don't want to say that this is among the reasons which concurred to stop the show, but certainly many people couldn't have been glad the Enterprise was almost turning into a romantic story, in great measure.
And then, this relationship would have been very difficult to handle.
So, judging from the way the authors thought to end the show (The Abomination), I'm almost glad that it did not there be a season 5.

I don't think you can judge anything from *the_abomination*. I think Connor Trinneer's theory about that one was right-on too.

If it had been the captain and T'Pol, you're probably right. But T and T they would have made hay with, probably in tiny doses, forever. You just can't ignore chemistry like that when it's sitting right there in front of you. And since they let Torres and Paris get together, I don't think it's inconceivable they would have ultimately allowed something like that with these two.

Eh Eh!
I'm very happy I am not the only eternal, incurable optimist.
But, joking apart, I agree totally with you, Alelou.

Me too I agree they TnT have great Chemistry and so much potential.i wanted to see them together like Alelou mentioned. very definitely and that's the way it should be with these two .