T'Pol's Un-Vulcan Like Behavior

[Silverbullet]

I really believe that Jolene thought she was being cute when she said that. Not thinking too well.

Believe that interview was early in the first Season.

Surpised that Jolene didn't get a outline of Trip's character. She would have known that he was not a Catfish eating Redneck Hick.

Writers may not have had him as he turned out but am fairly sure they had Trip as more than a hick.

[WarpGirl]

I think at first he was supposed to be insignificant compared to Archer. CT was too good at what he did and they had to adapt. They tried to push the impulsive not so sharp when it came to anything not in Engineering in season 2. But it didn't work THANK GOD! The Seventh didn't only assassinate T'Pol's character. Trip's was handled far worse IMO.

[Silverbullet]

First two seasons neither Trip or t-Pol were handled right.

Trip was made out as the Comic Relief and T-Pol was relegated to Loyal, hero worshipping, side kick for Archer.

It wasn't until season three that either had any real character development and for
T-Pol her character came in for more assisination.

[panyasan]

In her defense it was she didn't see how any VULCAN female would go for Trip. And that annoyed me.

For the top of my head, she said that she didn't think a serene person like T'Pol would fall for Trip, but then she added something like "but if they can write it well, maybe it can work."
She sees her character as the meditating kind, withdrawn maybe, a true Vulcan. From a Vulcan point of view, Trip doesn't seemed to fit what people see as suitable for a Vulcan. Appearance can be deceiving. I think there is evidence that later in the show both actors took their role and the relationship seriously. T'Pol was pretty annoyed by *the_abomination* and both of them didn't show up at the party after that last episode.

[Silverbullet]

Just watched e2 again a few minutes ago.

T-Pol certainly pushed Trip away and was even curt with him.

There were some interesting things.

Her reaction when Lorain called her MOther. Startled.

In sickbay when phlox showed T-Pol Lorains DNA and commented that there was Human Dna in it T-Pol said that was not possible. she said, Humans and Vulcans have never been able to conceive. that says that there had been other Vulcan human couples before TnT.

Phlox says he has or will invent a method so that Vulcans and Humans can conceive.

Also intersting is when Archer asks who is the father. He looks down and seems to be expecting Phlox to say that he is.

T-Pol's reaction when Phlox says comander tucker is funny. Instead of rejecting the idea in her face or voice she looks as if she is considering it as possible.

Later on when Archer says that he can send trip up to see the old t-Pol, she says that
it would be "awkward." Why? Trip was the man she loved, married, lost and proably missed and mourned for decades why wouldn't she want to see him. that has always bothered me.

Later when the two T-Pol's talk and the old one says that Trip can help the young one and the young one rejects that. The old one says to follow your Heart. Young t-Pol says suppose my Heart doesn't know what it wants.

that is baloney too. She knew when she seduced him. She knew in that shower scene in
Damage and she knew when she consoled him in the forgotten. so it is a bit strange she should deny that her Heart did not know it wanted Trip.

[WarpGirl]

OK Remember she's going through detox. When drugs leave your system it's traumatic physically, emotionally, mentally, the pain is almost unbareable. Add to that the guilt of 18 people dying, the complete abandonment of her culture, the belief that she and Trip would destroy her scant control, and him as well... No I understand T'Pol she wasn't trying to be cruel, she did want Trip. But her life was a MESS. Her health was shattered in every way, she's an addict, she screwed up her life royally. And here is this other life thrust on her, a son she believed to be impossible even if she thought she and Trip could work, and the fact that her alternate self only had Trip for 14 years, leaving her alone for almost 100 years. I'd freak out too.

I thought the look on Archer's face was telling, he looked furious.

[Silverbullet]

Didn't think Archer looked furious as much as anticipating and then disappoiinted.

It was what the old T-Pol said to the young one that was intersting and telling. She was telling the young one that Trip ws her salvation and that she should let Trip help her.

T-Pol's rejection of this seemed to be stupid given their past history.

[WarpGirl]

You're equating fear with rejection. She was terrified, not of Trip per se but what Trip represented, and the idea that she had destroyed herself and nearly destroyed him. You're not remembering the guilt and anguish her actions are causing her. And she's terrified that *her* Trip won't react the same way Trip2 will.

[Silverbullet]

Trip2 Married his T-Pol. She obviously loved him enough to marry Him and have a son with him. Trip2 overcame her pushing hmi away. Trip 2 like the young Trip Presented the
older T-Pol with the same powerful feelings that frightened her.

But as the old T-Pol said she couldn't imagine what life would have been without him.

The young t-Pol must have realized all of this. We never found out what happened to the Trip2 that he died. But had he not the older t-Pol would still be married to him.

I still canot see why the writers had the older t-Pol saying that she did not want to see Trip because it would be awkward.

What gets me is that the younger t-Pol sees that marriage to Trip not only possible but desirablle. That given help from Phlox they could have children, that she not be terrified that a vulcan Human relationship or marriage woud not work. the old t-Pol was
proof of that.

[WarpGirl]

Who knows how long it took for T'Pol2 too come to the conclusion that she and Trip could work. I'm pretty sure they didn't demand that the Captain marry them the instant they knew they were stuck in the past. Also now that T'Pol2 is once again in "the future" she knows T'Pol1 has hit the very rock bottom of her existance up to this point. She tells her that if she accepts Trip it will all be alright, and that's fine... But T'Pol1 is still not in the headspace to actually believe it. I don't understand how can you not see how messed up she is. She's not capable of thinking rationally.

Also remember BOTH crews are trying to STOP from going into the past again in order to save Earth, therefore their futures will be ENTIRELY different. Possibly no Lorien, THAT'S what T'Pol1 was trying to tell Trip. It isn't the fact she doesn't like it or want it, but they're trying not to go into the past.

Finally if I were a Vulcan and I only had 14 years with the love of my life, and I was close too 180 years old. It would break my heart to see that man again still young, and vital, knowing that violating my younger self's privacy might have him lose her for good. Thereby denying him the one thing he wants and breaking his heart. I wouldn't want to see him either. Why got through the pain of losing him twice? That makes no sense.

[Silverbullet]

How could t-Pol2 invade T-Pol the younger's privacy by seeing Trip?

How would the t-Pol2 lose the young Trip. He would know she was the older counterpart of his t-Pol.. He would talk to her but his heart would still belong to the young t-Pol

ADmittedly it would probably pain the older t-Pol a bit seeing him and forcing her to remember her Trip that she had lost so long ago.

However, I think that T-Pol2 would realize that the young Trip would never be hers but belonged to the young t-Pol.

I would have liked to have seen the young t-Pol and her Trip talking to T-Pol2 together. They have may gained some insights that might have led to a better understanding of their relationship.

[WarpGirl]

It would invade T'Pol1's privacy for T'Pol2 to tell Trip about her emotions and addiction. That's not her right, she's not the same T'Pol anymore. God that would have been awful.

[Silverbullet]

Good Morning

Who says that the T-Pol2 would tell the young Trip anything about T-Pol1's addiction? T-Pol2 was not a fool and she was a vulcan and vuclans do NOT blab personal things to Humans even ones who are in love with thier younger selves. She would leave that up to the young t-Pol. If she wanted to tell the Young Trip all then she would but the old t-Pol would keep her mouth shut and respect the young T-Pol's privacy.

the old t-Pol might tell the young trip how she and her Trip fell in love beccause she knew that her life and the young t-Pol's life paralled until the older one entered that tunnel and got thrown back in time.

that is both the young and the Old t-Pol did the same things, getting jealous of cole, Seducing Trip, the shower scene the whole nine yards until the throw back in time. that is where their lives seperated. The old t-Pol would know that if the young enterprise made it past that tunnel and met Degra then the young Enterprise and its crew would begin to live sepearate lives so no guarntee that TnT would marry. but the old t-Pol could tell the young trip how he might become more attched to the young one and to get the young one more attaacted to him. After all she had been through that with her Trip and she knew what happened with them.

What the old t-Pol could and should have told the young t-Pol was how to stop fighting her trip and how to accept what he had to offer and to tell her it was her best chance of happiness. since the young t-Pol seemed to ignore almost everything that she heard or saw.

[WarpGirl]

Old T'Pol has no right to tell Trip young T'Pol is in love with him. To a Vulcan that is more private than a drug addiction.

[Silverbullet]

Old T-POL would not have to tell Trip that the young T-Pol was in love with him he had a good hunch about that. She must have revealed someting the night she Seduced him.

I think that Mike Sussman (who was an ardent A/Tper) wrote the dialogue where t-Pol almost snarled her words t Trip and saying that he had no sense since he wanted an intimate relationship just because of a sexual encounter. she said that to him twice. both times wih her face showing anger at him.

That was OOC. Dammit she intiated the Seduction. She had the wet dream of the shower scene. She helped with comfort when he was crying about his sister. That was not just one firend consoling another that was a female consoling her mate.

When he tried to help her because she had helped him she again spurnded him. Again OOC. He was supposed to be her firend even is she was feelig guilty and confused.

That whole e2 episode was Mike sussman and it stunk vis-a-vis TnT