Avatar *Here there be spoilers*

[Distracted]

I read on AP wire that Avatar had "hidden" anti-war and environmental messages. HA. If that's hidden, I don't know what obvious is.

That's what I thought, too. It's not like this film has a hidden agenda. Cameron practically smacks you in the face with his "agenda". It's what the movie is ABOUT. But just because I'm far from a liberal doesn't mean I can't enjoy the movie at face value as pure entertainment.

[WarpGirl]

Why is it that it seems like agendas are turning into something bad in society? I'm not saying all POV's are right or necessarily good. But it seems to me that the word agenda is being tossed around by people or groups with their own agendas as something bad when trying to discredit other people's agendas. The way I see it if you're a human being living life sooner or later agendas will come into that. So if people must attack agendas, (and they must it seems) then attack what the agenda IS. Not the fact that there is an agenda.

[Ezinma88]

I watched Avatar in 3D a couple of days ago... and I can't stop thinking about it. The quality of the world Cameron's created! This is a place that carries on existing long after the credits have rolled. It easily makes my top ten science fiction films of all time list.

I try to avoid spoilers/trailers - infact any details about films - before I actually watch them. So, thankfully I didn't have to fight against any preconceptions when I saw Avatar.

This film could have been really preachy with it's eco message - like 'The Day the Earth Stood Still'. It could have bashed the audience over the head with it's Iraq war/Vietnam metaphors or star-crossed lovers theme. But, the writing's too good for such blunt tactics.Try to forget anything you've heard or seen. If you like science fiction (and let's face it, if you're on this forum, you probably do) then watch Avatar. It's as simple as that. If you don't see this at the cinema and in 3D, then you'll be missing out big time.

I also thought Zoe Saldana was brilliant! There are a couple of really interesting featurette videos that explain how the *exact* performance of each actor was replicated.

Look at the bottom of this page http://www.empireonline.com/reviews/rev ... FID=133552

[honeybee]

Nobody should be scared off of Avatar because of its message - which is a fundamentally positive one. It's anti-genocide and anti-wholesale rape of the environment for profit. I for one am perfectly comfortable with that message - and as Ezinma88, the writing is very beautiful and the message is very organic to the story. It is, essentially, a myth or a fairy tale - so it isn't morally complex in its presentation - but it's done well and the story has substance. And last time I checked NEITHER American political party was in favor of genocide or the wholesale rape of the environment - there might be some disagreement on how to intervene or what constitutes environmental rape - but I don't think it's part of the current political mainstream to be in favor of what the villains are doing in this film. If it is, I think we should all be worried. And I have friends and colleagues all political stripes. To dismiss something based on the knee-jerk notion that it's "politically correct" and therefor worthy of dismissal is silly. The movie is about a human man discovering his "better angels" and sticking up for what he believes is right at potentially great cost to himself.

Also, there is a deep, deep spiritual and religious message at the core of the film. In the end, it asserts the notion that there is a God and there is life after death. The same forces that decry politically correctness are constantly whining about Hollywood's war on religion - and this is a deeply spiritual film. But like the more political messages, whatever your religion, I think the spirituality in the film is organic to the story - and I didn't find it off putting or preachy. It was just part of the mythology of the film in the way that "The Force" is part of Star Wars.

Again, some of the imagery and some of the ideas I think are worthy of discussion - and I wish there had been some more depth in the story - but that doesn't take away from the achievement of the film. James Cameron created a beautiful, Utopian vision - and I certainly enjoyed spending some time in Pandora. And I love the idea of a new generation being captivated by a an imaginary world the way I was when I first watched reruns of TOS with my brother or when that same brother took me to see Star Wars.

[Aikiweezie]

I am intrigued......probably won't get to see it in the theater, though. Not if we can't bring our son.

[WarpGirl]

Well I think it sounds cool. And I'm anti-politics anyway. But speaking as a dedcated SW's fantic, I gotta say I'm in the small minority that doesn't equate the Force itself as a religion. I suppose you could take the different codes Force users have followed as psudo-religions, but the Force itslef just isn't. Again I'm in a minority. Anyway Movie looks cool. Now how to get there????????

[Distracted]

I am intrigued......probably won't get to see it in the theater, though. Not if we can't bring our son.

You guys never go see adult type movies, Aikiweezie? Seems to me that an adult night out every now and then is a necessary thing for a marriage. That's what babysitters are for.

[Aikiweezie]

We do get out for date night, but not as often as I'd like.

[Elessar]

I have a review lined up for the film as well but I'm late meeting some friends for wings n drinks n trivia a la Buffalo Wild Wings

I saw the film in a 3D theater and short answer is that I loved it. Long answer is forthcoming

PS: did anyone else notice the year is 2154?

[Distracted]

Is there some significance to that year other than it's a year when Enterprise is supposed to be on active duty?

I can actually see Avatar blending into the ST universe. Maybe the mining company's sleeper ship left right before Earth got warp technology operational and after they sent Khan and his augments away on their sleeper ship. Anybody feel a crossover fanfic coming on?

[WarpGirl]

Wait if somebody does a crossover I'll be spoiled before I con someone into taking me! Not Fair!

[Ludmila]

Thank you, Distracted, for the cogent argument and suggestion to watch this movie. I at first heard the excellent opinion about "Avatar" from my colleague who does not like sci-fi but her husband took her with him in the usual theater and later repeated the experience alone without his wife in 3D (there is a problem with tickets and now). I do not like to go in the cinema during the stir. But you sounded quite enticing. As a result I saw "Avatar" today in the small showing room with 3D-glasses. I thoroughly enjoyed this movie and regretted only that I did not wish to have the troubles of the two trips to another end of the city for buying tickets in IMAX. But maybe I'd have a company for it in January. Even for today outing in the ordinary theater my friend bought tickets yesterday.
I suppose that this thread may content the spoilers. I put the few blank lines as a caution if I am not right.









First of all I was absolutely delighted the introduced alien world. It was so beautiful and was felt as very real (fortunately for my enjoyment my brain practically muffled by the flood of the evoked feelings did not offer any critique). The seeds of The Tree Of Souls reminded me of jellyfishes but I adored their role as a sign of Na'Vi's god (who was perceived by me for all that as a rational moon – the big rational being). I was impressed most the reaction of the big white flowers on Jake's childish pranks and the illumination of the night Pandora with the glowing plants and the amusing flying creatures. The floating rocks were cool though I saw in April on some fantasy site the nice wallpaper with the levitating small clod with the castles on them. And it scales down my surprise. I liked that the predators was shown not as a monstrous creature from "Aliens".

I loved the original portrayal of the mental control when that peculiar contact is needed. I am not sure but I do not think that Na’vi used it for the direct exchange and sharing of their thoughts. I might appreciate the adding of the telepathy in the mix.
The concept of Avatars was very interesting. It was more plausible (and catchy for viewing) to create the body of the hybrid of the specific person rather than the universal avatar for every operators (such as a robotic armor, though maybe it was needed the adjustment in that case as was shown in the "Starship Troopers 3. Marauder"). I hope that both human body and avatar were able to rest during the absence of the essence of their host.

I liked that there was more than one good human - and the scientists studying the Na'Vi - are not "evil" mad scientists - they are complicated.

Sigourney Weaver was absolutely amazing here. I liked and respected her Dr. Grace Augustine who was not indifferent to others from her first scene and till her last one when she was a scientist for her last breath.
The villains were one-dimensional of course. But I am glad that the precious time was spending for the development of the good characters.
The scene with Jake Sully's reaction on his second body and the possibility to use his legs was memorable. I satisfied that it did not convert him momentarily in the native convert and he had to go the long way for this inner transformation.
It was very refreshing that the good characters had their difficult choices. Jake and the pilot must fly in the face of the cruel orders. Na’vi had the credibility gap in her chosen alien. Their love story was well done.
I was only disappointed a little by the too flamboyant introduction the way to win Na'Vi's confidence. I waited to implement this scheme much before though in that case the atrocity of the greed manager and the unbridled fire-eater (I do not wish to call him the soldier) could not take place. But I give here the benefit of the doubt Jake indeed must be thrown in at the deep end for such reckless act.

Thanks to Ezinma88 for the link to the well-written Empire review!!! I especially loved in that review the line about the depiction of the feelings via the different shots of their eyes:
"Jake and Neytiri’s burgeoning love is contained in the intricacies of detail in the eyes – a flicker of longing here, a widening of the pupils or a rolling tear there, that further aids the illusion that these conglomerations of ones and zeros actually exist. It’s a genuinely engaging relationship – just because they’re aliens doesn’t mean they have to be alienating. "

I am very fond of civilization and am no luddite. So, I've never been terribly sucked in to the idea of "going native" and "getting back to nature". However, if going native meant living in a world as clean and pretty as Pandora - with as teeth as good as the Na'Vi appeared to have - I'm all on board. Those tree hammocks looked pretty comfy.

I was taking pleasure only as the onlooker. I prefer the contaminated air and water to the wild life (even to the country-side life) if it is the price of using the technological progress. I do be a sucker for the images of the beautiful nature (in the safety of my room).

We never know why earth needs this unobtanium so badly - is there a reason? is it saving lives?

My expression was that this mineral may be a very profitable energy source not something that is important for saving lives.

[honeybee]

I read a commentary on Slate.com today that I agreed with - it said the two most amazing moments in the film were when we saw the 9 Foot Na'Vi interacting with the humans. We have the big fight scene on the ship - and the scene where Neyteri finds and then holds Jake in his human form. That scene was probably my favorite in the whole film - and the fact that the CGI felt so organic to the story - I wasn't broken out of the moment - it was just - "Wow, the Na'Vi really are different. They are HUGE." We knew that - but when I saw it - it had a lot of dramatic punch.

And given Neyteri's initial prejudice against humans and her recent anger at Jake - to see her be able to recognize and love him in human form was a great moment.

[Distracted]

It almost seemed as if she had maternal feelings for Jake's human form, the way she cradled him like that and kissed the top of his head, which would make sense since humans are about the same size as a Na'Vi toddler.

[WarpGirl]

OK that's creepy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!