What are you...

[Asso]

My little boy started to have a fever this evening and he just woke up. He is burning up and has a high fever. Because of past experience, this things always sort of freak me out. Hopefully he is better in the morning.

He will.

Thanks, doctor Asso!

Was I right?

[panyasan]

He will.
Was I right?

When I was reading this, the little guy walked toward my desk and spilled his apple juice on deks and on the floor. He thinks it's very funny. The mouse is still sticky. Now he comes to me and says "mama", points to his t-shirt and says "wet, t-shirt", I help him and then he takes off, with a big smile "you can't caught me." Yip, he is better.

[Asso]

[Elessar]

He will.
Was I right?

When I was reading this, the little guy walked toward my desk and spilled his apple juice on deks and on the floor. He thinks it's very funny. The mouse is still sticky. Now he comes to me and says "mama", points to his t-shirt and says "wet, t-shirt", I help him and then he takes off, with a big smile "you can't caught me." Yip, he is better.

What a cute'n!

[panyasan]

I just received a message from WarpGirl (working from her parents computer) that her own computer is down and wouldn't connect with internet. She misses the forum and hopes to have internet soon again.

[panyasan]

... trying to figure out something. In Terra Prime Phlox says to captain Archer "I wish I could do more" when he watches Trip and T'Pol watching their child in sickbay and he makes a plea to the captain that something good would come out of this.
If my memory serves me right, after this, you see the scene that Trip and T'Pol now that all hope is gone and they both sighed in grief, but I am not sure. Looked at the transcripts and tried other sources, but maybe some one would know.

[Alelou]

I assumed that the next cut to Trip and T'Pol in that scene shows them both reacting to the child's actual death.

[Silverbullet]

Alelou, think you are right. Trip looks upwards as if asking God "why?" and T-Pol turns away
from the incubator.

I have said before probably else where that the scene would ahve had mor power if T-Pol
had turned, stepped into trips arms and they consoled each other over thier child's death.

Never liked that bit of Phlox asaying "Captaiin make something good come of this." what was archer supposed to do to make something good come of elizabeth's death?

[Distracted]

I think the idea was that Archer, being a GOD among men, would somehow find a way to make the child's death mean something by defeating/discrediting Terra Prime, thus fostering a spirit of tolerance toward non-humans and starting the Federation... or some such feel-good nonsense.

I personally see no way to turn any child's death into a "good thing", even if we're just dealing with a character on a TV show who was created by the writers specifically to make an emotional impact. That's what she was, you know. A plot device to make us cry. Why else would the writers have created her? It's the same rationale they used for *the_abomination*. Meting out death just to mess with us and get us "emotionally invested" in the series. Well, if they wanted to make an impact, they certainly succeeded, otherwise we would all have moved on by now.

[Asso]

You're right, Dis. But I think there's a big difference between Elizabeth' death and "The abomination."
The first one has some "Logic", someway.
"The abomination"... what the hell is it?

[Silverbullet]

Had, at the end of "Terra Prime" Elizabeth's death been used to positively bring Trip and T-Pol together as a couple commited to being together the rest of their lives then it would have made some sense.

The end was too ambigious, again. I have read some AinT's say that T-Pol was just comforting Trip and nothing else. Lot's of TnT types say it is a sign that T-Pol is finally accepting Trip. That is why I say if Elizabethr's death had been shown to at last bring her parents together it would have been a fitting end of the series.

[JadziaKathryn]

I think the idea was that Archer, being a GOD among men, would somehow find a way to make the child's death mean something by defeating/discrediting Terra Prime, thus fostering a spirit of tolerance toward non-humans and starting the Federation... or some such feel-good nonsense.

Well, yes. I agree.

But there are people who, say, loose a child to a disease or something and start groups to raise awareness/find a cure, etc, and they often say they wanted to make something good come out of their pain. I suppose it makes sense in a way, to say, "let this suffering not be for nothing." So in that sense I guess Phlox's comment isn't totally dumb.

[Aikiweezie]

Had, at the end of "Terra Prime" Elizabeth's death been used to positively bring Trip and T-Pol together as a couple commited to being together the rest of their lives then it would have made some sense.

The end was too ambigious, again. I have read some AinT's say that T-Pol was just comforting Trip and nothing else. Lot's of TnT types say it is a sign that T-Pol is finally accepting Trip. That is why I say if Elizabethr's death had been shown to at last bring her parents together it would have been a fitting end of the series.

I just watched Terra Prime again today on the big HD TV (you really pick up more) here at home and a couple of things were very obvious to me.

1) Both Trip & T'Pol were DEVASTATED by Elizabeth's death. At the end, T'Pol is so full of sadness and despair. Compare this to her reaction to her mother's death, or rather, her stated reaction to her mother's death. She isn't even trying to pretend she is fine. She isn't meditating, she isn't working, she is just grieving.

2) She does not place her hand on top of Trip's to comfort him, she slides her hand under his, as though she is looking for HIS comfort. This is a big thing the way I see it.

[Asso]

[... She does not place her hand on top of Trip's to comfort him, she slides her hand under his, as though she is looking for HIS comfort. This is a big thing the way I see it.

What you underlined so perceptively, and which I also noticed, settles things once and for all, in my opinion.
And about Phlox's words... I don't know: maybe they would make some sense if you take them just as a desire, a hope, a reminder. Probably he wanted to spur on the Captain to act, someway, in order that what happened wasn't only a bad thing, without any useful consequence. But you know: I'm an optimist.

[panyasan]

I always loved the scene when Trip comes to T'Pols cabin and is so emotional. I really dislike that fact that people something protrayed Trip as a crybaby because of this scene. He only had moistured eyes in The Forgotten, grieving his sister and he openly cries privately after losing his child. So it's not like he cries on everything, only with T'Pol and when he is grieving his child.

1) Both Trip & T'Pol were DEVASTATED by Elizabeth's death. At the end, T'Pol is so full of sadness and despair. Compare this to her reaction to her mother's death, or rather, her stated reaction to her mother's death. She isn't even trying to pretend she is fine. She isn't meditating, she isn't working, she is just grieving.

2) She does not place her hand on top of Trip's to comfort him, she slides her hand under his, as though she is looking for HIS comfort. This is a big thing the way I see it.

I like the way she reaches out to him, she offering her hand and then he takes her hand, it disappears in his, his hand is on top and they grieved together. Loved the way Trip is taking her hand with confidance and without hesitation, taking charge. He takes her hand like he has every right to hold her hand, they belonging together.