T'Pol's Un-Vulcan Like Behavior

[WarpGirl]

Yeah and that's why I get so mad about it. It was the first female Vulcan lead in ST history and she got screwed over. They made her weak and foolish and I don't think they would have put a man through half of what they did to her. She got telepathically raped twice, been drugged into Plak Tau, abused drugs, and had a communicable desease. And during all of this they screwed with her emotions, and tried to make her as dependent on Archer as possible. It makes me sick.

[pdsldl]

Okay so no outward emotions in public but then what about with her mate in private. There's no real canon to go on here. Many fanfics have them going at each other like rabbits (can't imagine that ever being realistic) nor can I see her not expressing herself to Trip (canon did have them having sex and kissing). What do you see as the balance?

Pa'Nar communicable i thought it was transmitted by an improperly done meld. If it was why would T'Pau have melded with her to correct the problem.

[WarpGirl]

Actually, I think that T'Pol wouldn't have a problem holding Trip's hand or kissing his cheek in front of family. Maybe even in private with very close friends. I can see her holding hands at movie night in the dark, an ozh'esta at anytime off duty. In complete private I say anything goes. I can even see T'Pol showing affection to Trip's family, hugs and the like. I've always imagined most Vulcans to be very physical with mates, children, and family in general. But in private. Family is more important to a Vulcan than logic is. Also Spock, Sarek, and Tuvok did express themselves in public. Maybe not through overt facial expression, but vocal inflection and body language spoke a great deal. Also the eyebrows. The key is control. T'Pol's emotions always seemed to control her and I hated that.

As for pa'nar it's pread from person to person. My brain might be dead but isn't that the difinition of communcible? If I'm wrong pardon my stupidity. I'm having a rough day.

[Silverbullet]

Warpgirl, when was she so dependent on Archer?

I know that the writers tried to make her a sidekick as Spock was to Kirk but it didn't work. Although they sure had her following him everywhere. She dogged his heels at all times.

T-Pol and Trip. Believe that she would be able to show him emotions in private but
in Public her vulcans sense of aropriate behavior would prevent that.

The syndrome supposedly was only passed through a bad mind meld.

[WarpGirl]

Yes but it was spread through a mind-meld by another person, therefore from person to person. And T'Pol did kiss Trip on the cheek in Home a statement of defiance surely, but if she was willing to do that, than I can see her doing it in front of family or intimate friends. I can't see much hugging though. At least not in front of people.

PS. Re-watch The Seventh again you'll see what I mean. A pattern continues.

[Silverbullet]

I would gouge my eyes out before I would re-watch the Seventh.

We seem to have different ideas a about communicable. to me it means that something can be spread generally to anyone nearby. Like a cold or the flue.

The syndrome had to be passed through a specific method between one person and another.
anyone nearby would not pick it up. So iin one way it can be passed on but only from one person to another by a mind meld.

[WarpGirl]

Maybe I'm brain dead today.

[pdsldl]

My point was that it the mind meld had to be an improperly done one not just a meld.

I don't see T'Pol as dependant. it was more they were trying to force a closeness that just didn't work and a friendship that wasn't earned. But then again Archer and Trips freindship seemed forced to.

[WarpGirl]

If one person does an improper mind-meld, than another get's pa'nar, than that person can spread it until someone who knows how to fix it comes along. Hence it is communicible. As for T'Pol and Archer, none of the respect he got was deserved.

[pdsldl]

If one person does an improper mind-meld, than another get's pa'nar, than that person can spread it until someone who knows how to fix it comes along. Hence it is communicible. As for T'Pol and Archer, none of the respect he got was deserved.

We had this discussion on another topic so I'm not going to rehash the difference between infecting someone and causing a syndrome of symptoms by doing something improperly.

And true rcher didn't earn respect it was handed to him by the writers,

[Silverbullet]

It always seemed to me that Archer and T-Pol had a professional relationshhip but nothing more no matter what the writers tried.

It was so obvious that ther was NO chemistry between Archer and T-Pol not in any of the episodes. Even in those two ANIS and Azatii Prime.

There might have been some justification for the writers to have that Decon scene
with Archer and T-Pol as they had lead up to that by having Archer dreaming the incident.

In Azati Prime I still cannot believe that T-Pol would folow Archer and whine that she didn't want to see him die and then go in to the ready room and start to cry.

Had that been Trip in ARchers place, yes.

That ARcher ad T-Pol crap was dropped until the forge arc and it failed then too.

[pdsldl]

I agree about A/T but even the Trip/Archer thing seemed fake. Mission or not they weren't close during the 3rd or fourth season. Trip being upset at the lose of Archer maybe but more out of the loss of the potential of regaining their lost friendship. Archer had no clue about what was going on with Trip and Trip was wrapped up so much in his problems with T'Pol that he didn't seem much interested in Archer's problems either.

[WarpGirl]

I always thought that Archer seemed to treat both Trip and T'Pol like theyy were his, like Porthos and Enterprise were his. When he tried to talk Trip out of transferring during The Aenar I got really really mad. I didn't see any AinT in the Vulcan arc just loyalty to a superior officer. But I hate the way T'Pol was like a faithful servent in places. Like in Damage she rightfully loses it when Archer decides to become a pirate, and then moans she didn't mean it and he was right. UG! Talk about UnVulcan behavior.

[pdsldl]

I would have thought as a Vulcan she would have seen taking the warp core it as wrong but logic would have overridden her objections because they had no choice. It was becoming obvious that more than Earth was at stake and the needs of the many took precedence of the needs of the few. Anger would be natural but it might not all have been directed at Archer. It may have come from being put it the position of stealing in the first place. Archer was just the easy target when the pressure built and she lost control.

If the writers wanted to make her human why didn't they just make her a human woman in the first place.

[WarpGirl]

If the writers wanted to make her human why didn't they just make her a human woman in the first place.

EXACTLY!!!! Thank you for making my point. But logic doesn't override morality even for Vulcans.