Major Rant : Angst

[Silverbullet]

Think that Mind Rape is a tad different thatn pysical Rape, The woman is violated, true. but I think the mind can recover frm a mental Rape easier than a physical one.

Rape is the ultimate insult to a female and the ultimate hurt. It is never done for sex but for humilitation and pain.

Ad I have said I have seen things over the years. I have seen females from the very young t the very old gang raped until they died. I mean truckloads of them. That is the reason I hate Rape in fiction or in the TV and films. I still remmeber pulling the bodies off the turcks because in addition to being Raped they were mutilated also.

So for me I would rather that T-Pol be left out of that kind of story or hoshi and any other female of the crew. Unrealistic? Sure but that is what fiction is often. I read for pleasure and view TV for the same reason. I don't need shock, terror or any o that associated with Rape. I have seen enough of it in my life.

[Kotik]

EEEEK

Is it just my flimsy self or did the word rape appear too often for comfort lately

[WarpGirl]

Fiction is also taken from life and unfortunately many horrible things occur in life. But I don't think mind rape is any different than physical rape at all, one is not better than the other.

[Distracted]

Well...not to say that I wouldn't personally abhorr being raped in any way, shape, or form (And, for the record, I have never personally been raped). But...it seems to me that, assuming that "mental rape" is even possible in the real world, it would be the less horrific of the two considering what I know about the disgusting things one can catch via physical contact. Of course, in ST there's PaNarr syndrome, so in the ST 'verse there's very little difference between the two. All I know is that I personally get a significantly greater reaction from the idea of physical rape than of mental rape.

[WarpGirl]

I don't see the difference when it comes to sci-fi. I really don't but hey I'm an odd duck.

[panyasan]

I am in the process of finishing my multichapter story and looking back, I would do things differently next time, so this kind of discussion helps me.

Although I can't see what's wrong with your story (I'm a little behind and I need to read what I didn't as soon as I can, but I loved what I read), learning and seeking for perfection is one of the great things about writing.

Thank you! I don't think there is anything wrong with my story, but like you said, writing is a learning process and at this point I thinking about different structures of telling a story, the flow of a story, that kind of things.

[panyasan]

Think that Mind Rape is a tad different thatn pysical Rape, The woman is violated, true. but I think the mind can recover frm a mental Rape easier than a physical one.

Rape is the ultimate insult to a female and the ultimate hurt. It is never done for sex but for humilitation and pain.

Ad I have said I have seen things over the years. I have seen females from the very young t the very old gang raped until they died. I mean truckloads of them. That is the reason I hate Rape in fiction or in the TV and films. I still remmeber pulling the bodies off the turcks because in addition to being Raped they were mutilated also.

This is really a horrible story, Silverbullet. Horrible.

[Escriba]

Yes in your case, Silverbullet, fiction as a way of escapism is understable (and I think, even beneficial.) But boy, TV shows, movies and books have to be like a minefield for you, because even sitcoms have a "very special episode" once in a while

The thing about mental rape is that I don't know if it's better at all. The body is a shell, after all. I've never been raped (although I've been assistant of the defense on a few rape cases) but I suffered sexual abuse in a bus (this rhymes!) when I was a young teen. I remember the fear and feeling more alone than I've felt in all my life and I remember I tried to take refuge in my head. You know "this is not happening, this is not happening." So the idea of someone violating your mind and not letting you take refuge even inside your own head because he's there, inside your deepest core and then you suffering his remininscence inside your mind for the rest of your life like worms crawling in your brain, it freaks me out.

Thank you! I don't think there is anything wrong with my story, but like you said, writing is a learning process and at this point I thinking about different structures of telling a story, the flow of a story, that kind of things.

Exactly! That's for me the best part of writing. Well, that and when somebody gets exactly what you meant in your story (that's the greatest feeling.)

[WarpGirl]

Wow all of that was really intense, I admire both of you so much. Still, it's nice to see two well thought out arguements on something. And it's nice to see that it was very respectful. Escriba I think you are absolutely right, to me both forms of rape have to be equally horrific. Especially when we're talking about Vulcan minds because their minds also control their bodily functions. So in my mind T'Pol has already gone through that hell twice, and well it's not surprising people write about it. What is surprising is how many people ignore it as easily as they do.

[CX]

Well...not to say that I wouldn't personally abhorr being raped in any way, shape, or form (And, for the record, I have never personally been raped). But...it seems to me that, assuming that "mental rape" is even possible in the real world, it would be the less horrific of the two considering what I know about the disgusting things one can catch via physical contact. Of course, in ST there's PaNarr syndrome, so in the ST 'verse there's very little difference between the two. All I know is that I personally get a significantly greater reaction from the idea of physical rape than of mental rape.

I don't know, what makes your skin crawl more? "I only want you for your body?" or "I only want you for your mind?" Either way they're getting their jollies, and either way they're forcing themselves into you while you are powerless to stop them.

[WarpGirl]

EXACTLY! And we humans can't be mentally violated in the same way because as far as I know there aren't any true telepaths documented. Think about it, someone literally inside your mind, and you have no escape. At least we're able to sort of seperate ourselves from our bodies, as Escriba said. But we can't seperate ourselves from our minds. Even to repress memories we have to be connected to our minds. Being mentally raped mean no escape, none, period. That is terrifying. And they did it twice to T'Pol and never once followed it up. Not only a little sick, but stupid.

[Silverbullet]

When one considers what is going on in places like the Sudan and Rwanda one does not need that sort of thing in entertainment of any kind be it books, TV or film. Too damned many Hrror films out today.

On reason that Men should avoid writng about Rape is that they cannot really concveive it's horror for a female or the fear of it that ;robably lives in many females minds. I cannot conceive of the violation I wold feel if that sort of thng hapened to me. Seeng horror and bein subjected to it are different animals. I believe that men should avoid Rape. Think that too many male writers use Rape in their stories because they are lazy and want to degrade their characters easily so a rape comes into mind.

I have read only one story where T-Pol suffers Rape and I hated it. Don't ever want to read another.

BTW, what I described was not the most horrific thing I saw that night by a long shot.

[WarpGirl]

I can understand that. But for some women (and men) keeping the subject "taboo" makes the situation worse. Like it's something the victim should be ashamed of. And that is not a good thing. So while I understand your POV I'm not sure I agree with it at all. It depends on how it's handled. The right approach can be helpful not harmful.

[Silverbullet]

Warpgirl, there is NO right way to handle Rape. it is violent, Painful, humilitating and soul searing to the woman. It can also tear a mariage apart, breakup engagements, put women in mental institutions turn some women into drunks trying to forget the experience. Also the woman lives with her perceived shame. Too often a Rape victem is treated like a wounded animal, people stare without pity. There is also the occasional preganacy from Rape. what does the woman do with the child? Put if up for adoption, keep it?

In many marriages the Husband may never resume sexual relations because his wife was violated and penetrated by another male. Those marriages end in divorce. in the ones that don't end in divorce it may takes a few years or more before the couple resume sexual rlations. Women expect their men to stand by them offer support and caring and too often get rejection instead.

then too often the woman is blamed partially for the rape because her actions or dress may have invited the attack.

[Asso]

Maybe this can sound strange, I'm Italian after all.
But I hate "Two Women".
"Miracle in Milan" is really another thing.