Vulcans... to swim or not to swim?

[Elessar]

Could also be a survival instinct... could be that when they DO get rain, b/c of desert topography, like in the deserts on Earth, they have very dangerous flash floods and they teach them to swim to survive.

[Aquarius]

I'm inclined to agree with Elessar there. That, and their society is much more advanced technologically, so they've been taking offworld travel for granted for a while, whereas Humans at this point don't leave their home soil hardly at all by comparison, so Vulcan logic may be reasoning that since you never know where you're going to end up, it's an essential skill to have.

Besides, I've never used algebra in everyday life, but for some reason they made me learn THAT any way... So if they can make me take more math than I need, they can make Vulcan kids learn how to swim.

[Kotik]

Somehow I can't shake off the feeling that the lot of us puts an great deal more effort in developing a coherent and thorough picture of Vulcans than the maker of ENT themselves

Maybe we should start fundraising and start producing season 5

[WarpGirl]

Asso dear, I'm not sure if you've ever watched VOYAGER, but if you have know that Tuvok states there are seas and lakes on certain continants on the planet. Also in the Whale movie SPOCK swims with the whales. Also you're right that some Vulcans do not like the open water, as they find it too unpredictable. But really I think you're too hard on Vulcans in general.

Now I always thought that Vulcans who leave their world for extended periods of time, either in their own space fleets, Starfleet, or just colonizing other planets, they would learn all survival skills necessary including swimming. Also just because Vulcans"evolved" on a desert planet doesn't mean they have to live on a desert planet or enviornment to be content. After all, Soval lived on Earth for 30 odd years. The biggest objection I see a Vulcan having with swimming is the COLD. They are very sensitive to cold.

[Asso]

You take me too seriously, WarpGirl. I'm always searching for a bit of humour, and, obviously, it's logical to think that Vulcans can swim.
Nevertheless that doesn't mean that they enjoy it.
And then...
Look, Italy has a big coastal development, but peoples who swim are only a little fraction of the population.
Therefore you are (partially) right about two things:
First. I didn't watch VOYAGER. I tried, but I found it hopelessly boring. And annoying too, at least for me. So I wasn't aware of Tuvok revelations. I ask for your pardon.
Second. You said: But really I think you're too hard on Vulcans in general.
About that, apparently you seem to be right, but, in reality, I'm very compassionate with them. But, please, think of that: a race, intelligent, smart, strong, restrained in the narrow limits of of their biological needs. They have to follow logic. Honestly I think who used this term to describe Vulcan path, would have needed to make some semantic research.

Think of that: I'm so sympathetic with Vulcans, that I desperately hope Trip manages to make T'Pol mend her ways.

[WarpGirl]

I don't think T'Pol has to mend her ways at all. She is who and what she is. She is a good person, who has fine morals, and tries to do whats right. Simply being of a different culture doesn't mean she needs to mend her ways. And I feel the same way about all Vulcans who are good people. If you had watched VOYAGER you would have learned that Vulcan couples do have strong loving relationships that have nothing to do with the seven year itch at all. Come to think of it the old TOS episodes deal with that.

Anyway about swimming, like I said I think that Vulcans who are off world a lot would probably learn, but since their body tempatures are so much higher, they'd probably be cool in a hot-tub. So the cold of the ocean, or a pool would be annoying.

[Asso]

Once again you want to discuss. My feelings and my perceptions about T'Pol and Vulcans are not those one you have.
I love T'Pol because she doubts.
And she has to find her road. And for me the right road is NOT the Vulcan road, or, at least, the Vulcan road the ILLOGICAL authors traced for Vulcans.
I'm not talking about different cultures. I'm talking about the ILLOGICAL way authors wanted to describe alien cultures.
WarpGirl. I have to be sincere: Vulcans - the way they are described - are completely ILLOGICAL for me. Please, don't try to get any word I say so as to arguing with me. Don't look for find in any of my sentences the right and the wrong.
For me whatever idea and whatever belief have their reasons.
But I also think that something INDUBITABLE has to exist. ASHAYA moves universe. If T'Pol doesn't understand this, she will be lost.
That's, obviously, my own thought.

[WarpGirl]

That's true. But, frankly, I have some feel that they are... contemptuous, too. To tell the true, this one is among the reasons, for me, because of which T'Pol has been so much struggling within with regard to her feelings for Trip. Vulcans don't need to swim. They fly in their technological spaceships, they have all they need. They are superior. Why the hell do they have to learn to swim?

Asso I'm not trying to argue or be nasty to you. But when you use words like "contemptuous" and "superior" to describe Vulcans as a society. I can't help but think that you don't like them, and do not want T'Pol to be apart of her culture. Hey you have a perfect right to feel that way, but it confuses me because if you do feel that way I wonder what it is about T'Pol you like from the first episode of ENT. Maybe it's the fact that we speak two different languages. But sometimes I can't understand what point it is you're trying to make. There is no anamosity just confusion.

[Asso]

Hey! What do you think? Could we talk Latin?

[WarpGirl]

The only latin I'm fluent in is Drs. Latin and although I realize that is your profession and I admire it, I speak it far too often in my own real life. So I'm good in Spanish and French take your pick.

[Asso]

French... I adore French.
You know. Brigitte Bardot!
Hey! Does she swim?

[WarpGirl]

Honestly when it comes to Vulcans swimming, I'm not sure why the question would come up. Obviously Spock knew how to swim. And I don't see Vulcans being all that rigid when it comes to activities. Codes of behavior, are of course rigid to a modern western viewpoint. But activities like swimming and sports? No. I think Vulcans can pretty much do whatever they want. I mean Vulcans play baseball, they wrestle, they do ballet and opera. So why do people think they're so regimented? It's a civilization not a military regime???

[Asso]

Eh eh...
I am not sure about that.

[WarpGirl]

Vulcans have words in their own language for Baseball, wrestling, ballet, opera, even leather tanning. All listed under jobs and activites Vulcans actively participate in. Like I said if you had watched Voyager you would know all of this. The concept of Vulcans you seem to really hate are actually the laws and policies of the corrupt VHC and they were infiltrated by Romulans. I'm sorry but true Vulcan society is much more liberal and you haven't seemed to learn anything about it. T'Pol isn't a rebel she's a true Vulcan (ignoring her druggie phase.)

[Asso]

Ok. I give up.
Once again I give up. I think it's better I go writing. Maybe someone will be sharing my feelings.